Morgan Cty World Record???????

[Hav2HuntEm]

It has been well over the 60 days required to get an official score on the massive controversial buck from Morgan Cty. What has happened to this deer? Has anyone heard anything new about this brute?

[Dean Weimer]

The deer hasn't been scored to my knowledge. And, the family doesn't seem to be responding to anyone's requests to do so. Don't know what will happen now.

[Bocephus]

John Bogucki told me that he was going to score it, and that he had talked to the guy that killed it.

[Dean Weimer]

I just talked to John a little while ago Bo. He tried to give them a call and the numbers no longer exist.

[sam fisher]

overheard dnr officer talking about this buck he was saying it has been confiscated? thats all i heard

[HuntinIN]

The trauma of harvesting a world class buck that is close to being a world record has ruined this poor kid's existence (and his family). Or, he could just still be looking for someone to score the point next to the right brow time as the G2. Or, he could have sold it. Or, which I believe, it was all done with smoke and mirrors. I hope the poor kid doesn't turn into a monster buck slaying hermit like Rompala. I demand to see an X-ray!!

[ICOKnoy]

Sam what was the name of the Officer you "overheard"? What County? Please don't start this B.S. again. THE DEER HAS NOT BEEN SIEZED!

[big dawg01]

I've heard that they changed thier phone # and that the buck is going to score or net close to 200 inches due to the deductions. It is still one HECK of a buck!!!!!I heard this from some one in the IDHA. I hope we get to see this GIANT up at the show in INDY. does anyone know if they are bringing it?
I want to see how my 184' looks beside him.:evil:

[HuntinIN]

At least we'll be able to see your 184" at the show. Oh, and if the Ferguson buck is there (which it won't be), yours will look small next to it.

Sam, you're right, there were DNR people saying that the rack was going to be confiscated.

Eric

[bigling97]

YET. I think you forgot to say YET.

[sam fisher]

lawman not starting bs just heard that statement sounds like dnr officers need to get on the same page? maybe thats the bs that needs to be fixed ?????ignorance is no excuse i think i've heard that somewhere!

i don't like the thought of this deer being illegal

it truely is an awesome buck for the hunter and the state

[ICOKnoy]

Still did not answer the question. What Officer, what county? When we have questions we call the Officer assigned to that particular area. In this case....it is my county. Any questions give us a call , there are 3 of us assigned here and I can assure you we are all on the same page.
Joel Arthur
Bryan Knoy
David Reese
(812)837-9536

[sam fisher]

madison county, dave is all i know and it was heard in an archery shop there in madison county you would think all officers would have the same info being we all live by the same laws not being an a hole just feel like you are attacking something i heard from one of your fellow officers this fellow isn't very friendly probably setting myself up to be harrassed

[CambyGSP]

With all the mystery surrounding the Morgantown Buck....will that increase or decrease the VALUE of the story when it is SOLD?


Whats known so far.....

The deer was NOT checked in by the successfull hunter

The fella that did have time to transport the "RECORD CALLIBER" deer to the check station, had ALREADY checked in a buck deer in his name during the 2005 deer season

The fella that checked the deer agreed to wear a "Outdoorsman" hat for the photo opportunity

It all may very well be a "staged" event. Build a mystery into the record deer and jack up the price for the "real story".

The "mystery" was staged from the very first post that hit the internet about this deer.

[ICOKnoy]

Camby, you are wrong...... The subject that checked the deer had not checked a deer for the 2005 season.

[BREWERSVILLE OUTFITTERS]

GOOD JOB DNR KEEP THE STORY STRAIGHT :bowdown::bowdown::bowdown:

[HuntinIN]

What story? That's why all the bs is still going on. Sure would be nice to see it exposed in some form other than this stuff, it would be good for Indiana. I think a lot of people's patience have worn thin. Maybe it is just all about money.

[treehugger]

What story? That's why all the bs is still going on. Sure would be nice to see it exposed in some form other than this stuff, it would be good for Indiana. I think a lot of people's patience have worn thin. Maybe it is just all about money.
About now...many of us have lost interest...

[CutNShoot]

........... Maybe it is just all about money.
Isn't it just sad that deer hunting has come to "just all about money"?

If we cant do some inner soul searching after this Jimmy Houston thing we need to examine our motives for deer hunting.

The days of just going deer hunting for fun is rapidly coming to a close. it is getting more and more about who can kill the biggest, get their name in some book and maybe make some money in the process.

Truly sad and we have no one to blame but ourselves.

"We have met the enemy and he is us" - Pogo Possum

[DaWG of Indpls]

I couldn't agree more. There are so many guys out there that are taking the fun out of this activity. For some guys/gals it is all about heads/antlers.

Maybe the guy that shot this buck doesn't want to share his success with the world. Maybe he is a private kind of guy. No need to try and make more of this situation than is factually correct. Stop the speculation. This story may never be published.

[Scott Werstler]

If I killed that deer and was:

a quiet guy
a person on land that others can hunt
a person who is afraid that his ground might get leased out from under him
a person who is afraid of poachers shining the area for the next several years


I would try to keep it as low key as possible!

In doing that if I read everything that I have on here, I would tell all of you to piss off and I would keep the deer with its fond memories to myself. It would ruin the enjoyment of the hunt to have to continually defend myself to a bunch of strangers. Know I hear from this thread that they had to change their phone number to have peace and quiet. Now I start to realize what Shaun Harvey went through and why that deer was almost never scored.

[Dean Weimer]

Well what does one say to all of this?? I personally agree with everyone and noone on this thread. Cut, once again, just because there are some meatheads out there that are money hungry A-holes doesn't mean we "all" are like that. Jimmy HOuston should have his nuggets cut off for hunting at Billard's Place. He should be shunned from the public eye completely. But not everyone (really only a small % of deer hunters as a whole) is like this. I once again refer to Sam Collora. Sam has been offered big dollars for the original Collora Buck, but Sam won't sell it for any amount of money. Period!!! His three Boone and Crockett bucks aren't even registered in Iowa's Record Book. Why?? Because Sam is a good man, goes to church, and sees the "Big Picture". He cares nothing about fame and/or getting on T.V. Sure, he runs a business, but doesn't try to ram his products down anyones throat. He's one of the very best deer hunters in North American, and his only motivation is "the challenge of taking on a big mature buck one on one".


Giant racked bucks have always been out there from the beginning of Creation. And, human beings have always been "transfixed" (for lack of better word) by huge racked whitetail bucks. Many of the prehistoric people carved pictures on cave walls of Giant Racked Bucks. Not some dinky spike buck...not to say that they didn't shoot a small buck, etc.
And, people with money have always been wanting to purchase whitetail racks, etc. As long as the person is ethical, etc. What's the big deal? People buy collectables all the time. Look at how people go GaGa over the homerun balls being hit these days. Maybe that was a bad example because of steroids, etc. , but you get what I mean.
I personally, am not driven by money, and or getting my name and face in record books and magazines. Sure I am a writer, and I love doing it. It's very fun and rewarding, but I am not a jerk about it. Don't touch this one Randy!!!:corkysm55 Deer hunting has become a Booming Business, but that is the American Way. Look around, don't you see CAPITALISM everywhere you look??? Hasn't it always been that way??? Deer hunting has become a Billion Dollar Industry, and is a small cog in the national economy. Lots of jobs have been produced because of this. You are ALWAYS going to have some numb nuts individuals that get stupid and make it look bad for everyone else.
Here is the truth. Deer hunting in America has never been any better than it is right now. These are the "Glory Days". Go out there and hunt your tail off and hopefully you'll get a giant worth writing an article about. Thank the Good Lord too, if you are so lucky. What you might do with a world record calibre buck is of you're OWN doing.
I've said it before and back it up again. None of us know exactly what happened with the Ferguson Buck. Nor are we in a position to "speculate" on what is happening. Maybe they just got burnt out on everyone hounding them about it. What would you do if your phone was ringing non stop with people demanding your time, etc???? Maybe you'd do the same thing...

( deleted )

[CutNShoot]

Do you not think that OUR antler worship is the root of all this evil that is happening?

Jimmy is a product of our ego driven lust for bigger antlers to hang on the wall.

Sorry, but I don't want deer hunting to be a "Booming Business".

It cheapens it immensely to put a price tag on it..

[Dean Weimer]

Read it again. I am not an antler worshipper. I am really beginning to think that you are though. Do NOT put me in the same group as yourself. Jimmy is a product of Jimmy...not anyone else.


Do you have a graph that has the money taken into the state coffers every year? You seem to have graphs for everything else. If deer hunting isn't about money, then why do all of the licenses go up all the time. Ask your buddy Mitchell if he'll lower the costs of licenses and bring back the lifetime licenses. How many Millions of Dollars a pumped into the General Fund every year??? Big Business??

EVIL???? What are you talking about...evil. Did we cause the Terrorists to Fly into the world trade center???? Are you out of your mind???? Ego driven lust??? What the...??!!!!!

[Bocephus]

Do you not think that OUR antler worship is the root of all this evil that is happening?

Jimmy is a product of our ego driven lust for bigger antlers to hang on the wall.

Sorry, but I don't want deer hunting to be a "Booming Business".

It cheapens it immensely to put a price tag on it..Cut, Please dont EVER EVER EVER compare us, we or me to Jimmy Houston!

Thats a good way to make enemies fast.

[HuntinIN]

Maybe the whole situation was caused by ignorance of the consequences of what the hunter and/or his father did with the pic, etc. and has nothing to do with money. Give them the benefit of the doubt. Everyone should just forget about it. Old news. Plenty of other world class deer out of IN this past season that will get to be honored.

[CutNShoot]

Cut, Please dont EVER EVER EVER compare us, we or me to Jimmy Houston!

Thats a good way to make enemies fast.
Sorry you took it that way Bo.

I'm saying by us going gaa-gaa over every big set of antlers (as most have doen on this Morgantown buck) and putting these guys up on a pedestal we are enabling this stuff to happen.

If there was no market (the hunting public is buying them) for these videos showing big bucks getting killed and ESPN and the Outdoor Channel wasn't selling spots for ads on these big buck video shows and then we wouldn't be buying that product - these guys wouldn't be in business.

But a LOT of folks buy that stuff and provide an income for these guys. It seems that some want to be like that celebrity hunter as he is killing what we want - big antlers.

IMHO - deer hunting has become perverted and we allowed it to happen.

[big dawg01]

At least we'll be able to see your 184" at the show. Oh, and if the Ferguson buck is there (which it won't be), yours will look small next to it.

Sam, you're right, there were DNR people saying that the rack was going to be confiscated.

EricYes my buck will be at the show and I can not wait to see all the other trophies up there.
I heard the morgantown buck was checked in by the father, the son
"wich" killed the animal was either in shool or at work. I got this info from some one in the IDHA. Time will tell. I hope all the rumers are not true and this monster was taken in a leagal manor!
It would be a shame to lose such a buck to a poacher!!!
I'm supprised that the rumor mill has not started on my buck.

[Dean Weimer]

I heard Hawgs buck was shot in DeKalb County by some Outdoor Writer, and then it was stolen by some dude from "down South". I'll bet that writer sure wishes he could have "his" rack back.:bonk:

[Bocephus]

Yes my buck will be at the show and I can not wait to see all the other trophies up there.
I heard the morgantown buck was checked in by the father, the son
"wich" killed the animal was either in shool or at work. I got this info from some one in the IDHA. Time will tell. I hope all the rumers are not true and this monster was taken in a leagal manor!
It would be a shame to lose such a buck to a poacher!!!
I'm supprised that the rumor mill has not started on my buck.Seems like maybe you WANT the rumor mill to be started about your buck.
ANYWAY....
My friend just had his buck scored by Phil Hawkins, 184 non-typical. Phil said he measured it three time and couldnt come up with the extra inch to be B&C.

[big dawg01]

No I do not want the rumor mill to get started on my buck!!!!!

I count my self VERRY LUCKY too have harvested such an animal!
It has taken me 26 long years to do so. Espicaly with my phisical limitations. I am a disabled Veteran and at times it is hard for me to do the things most of you take for granted, but I still get out there and hunt as hard and long as I can.

I have several other mounts on my wall a few of them that would not even score 125 and they all are trophies to me!!!
I hope you all will take this into consideration about my self and my ethics.
And as far as people trying to make $$$ on their trophies & or hunting experience I think if you can make it more power to you. I think it is just- rewards for all the things we buy from the hunting industry every year. $35 for deer pee and such.
As far as my tropies they are not for sale! But my story and experience is, just for the fact that they may help an other hunter out there!
As GOD as my witness if my 9 yr. old son would have been with me that morning he would of been the one DROPING THE HAMMER on this monster,
and I think thats what is all about!

[INBowhunter]

Glad to see you found this site too Chris.

[HuntinIN]

Congratulations on your buck. 184" N.T. is bigger than a lot of hunters will ever see. Sounds like you earned it after years of hunting, awesome. I watched Hawkins score my buddies hrb typical, he does a great job.

Eric

[Dean Weimer]

Hi everyone, Yes, Phil Hawkins does a fine job, but I have to comment on something that you said Bocephus. Are you sure that Phil scored that deer three times??? HRBP, B&C, and P&Y scorers should NEVER have to score a deer more than once. Deer should be scored one time and one time only. I'd hate for people to see what you said there and "take it and run with it". Scorers don't EVER "try to get another inch", because there is NEVER another inch to get. By saying this you might get some people to think that certain bucks should, or could get more of a score. I'm not saying you are full of it (but really I think you are :bouncy: )...just trying to start some misinformation from perpetuating into something greater.

I heard a story from one of the best scorers in Indiana who once had a guy offer him money to get another 1/8 inch, so his 169 7/8 " Typical could be in the Boone and Crockett all-time book. This scorer promptly rejected the "offer" and told the guy that there wasn't another 1/8 inch to "give him". The "hunter" was irrate. These are the kind of people that are "ruining" deer hunting, not the regular Joes like us who just love to hunt big deer.

[oldrookie]

Dean.......just got to sur the mud dont we.:biggrin:


oldrookie

[Scott Werstler]

Each measurement is each measurement. I have never measured a deer more than once, but I have taken a measurement more than once. For instance, its easy to get a different measurement for main beam length each time and so sometimes I measure that particular distance more than once. It depends on the type of curve the beam has, the amount and size of bumps you must go over, and generally how "it feels" as you lay the cable along the beam. I do this as I make the measurements though and before I record it, rather than at the end of the scoring session when I know what the total is. Maybe this can clarify what Dean said and what Bo said.

[Scott Werstler]

I'm your huckleberry. I live south of Larwill on State Road 5. I can score for both organizations. My number is 260-723-5858, usually home after 6. I plan to measure a couple on Sunday for some other guys.

[Bocephus]

Hi everyone, Yes, Phil Hawkins does a fine job, but I have to comment on something that you said Bocephus. Are you sure that Phil scored that deer three times??? HRBP, B&C, and P&Y scorers should NEVER have to score a deer more than once. Deer should be scored one time and one time only. I'd hate for people to see what you said there and "take it and run with it". Scorers don't EVER "try to get another inch", because there is NEVER another inch to get. By saying this you might get some people to think that certain bucks should, or could get more of a score. I'm not saying you are full of it (but really I think you are :bouncy: )...just trying to start some misinformation from perpetuating into something greater.

I heard a story from one of the best scorers in Indiana who once had a guy offer him money to get another 1/8 inch, so his 169 7/8 " Typical could be in the Boone and Crockett all-time book. This scorer promptly rejected the "offer" and told the guy that there wasn't another 1/8 inch to "give him". The "hunter" was irrate. These are the kind of people that are "ruining" deer hunting, not the regular Joes like us who just love to hunt big deer.Dean-o,
Slow down bud, The comment my friend made was that Phil scored it three times and it always came up 184. Im sure he just wanted to make sure because it was non-typical. I had a scorer at the Hoosier Deer Classic about 12 years ago measure a 26pt. non-typical twice to make sure he was accurate. The Horns on the 26pt. were loose because the deer was shot in the head. They had a little wobble in them so they couldnt score the spread. So they scored the antlers as sheds. They scored 199 1/2 inches. I didnt post that "measured three times comment" to have any kind of controversy because there is none. The hunter and the scorer are friends and it was something that was just done to be sure. I have known this hunter for years and he could care less if his deer made the record books. He said he was happy that made the Hoosier book, but if it didnt he would still be just as happy. Its the biggest buck he has ever killed.

And before you guys even ask, the 26pt. that was killed with a head shot was killed in the late 70's by an old rabbit hunter I know. He jumped this deer in a thicket and scared this old guy half to death. He shot it as it lunged at him. He took it to the local game warden and told him what happened and they let him keep the deer. Its an awsome rack and he said I could take it to get it scored. That rack is in a will to me. Someday I hope to have it mounted on a head....I'll send pictures sometime.

[Dean Weimer]

No problem Bo, I just wanted to clear that up so some people don't get the wrong ideas. You with me??


Scarlet, Scott Werstler is the :bowdown: zen master, jedi knight, mac daddy, pimp daddy (not really), super scorer near you. Although he can't kill a buck, he is perhaps the best scorer in Larwill, Indiana. The only scorer I know who is better is up in DeKalb County. Scotty Don't!!!!

[Bocephus]

or faces with names even

[CambyGSP]

No need to score it more than once?

What it scores the first time is what it will score every time?

I don't understand why it takes a "panel" to score the really big ones then.

[treehugger]

I can only speak about the one guy I have personally met that scores for the HRBP and scored my deer this year. If they are all as "into it" and on the "up and up" as Gary Handlin is then the HRBP is in good hands!!!

I also had a guy score my deer for the Buckmasters program and was as impressed with him as with the HRBP scorer. Without telling him what the gross score was from the HRBP scorer he came up with the same composite score for the Buckmasters program. The score "is what it is".

treehugger

[Dean Weimer]

Of Course you don't understand it Camby...


All right everyone...a question. Do I really have to explain to Camby why they have "panels" score potential state, world, etc. record heads???????

[treehugger]

Of Course you don't understand it Camby...


All right everyone...a question. Do I really have to explain to Camby why they have "panels" score potential state, world, etc. record heads???????

Uuuuuhhhh!!! Would that be to protect the integrity of the program and to prevent the appearance of impropriety of any of the people involved for those out there that may (would) cast doubt on the process...just my guess Dean, how did I do?

[Dean Weimer]

A...Tree!!!!!!

[Scott Werstler]

It can also be used to settle judgement calls. Remember the Zaft buck. How about the Beatty buck and the Louvensten buck. A lot of decisions have to be made and not everyone will make the same one. Having a panel gets everyone to come to a consensus. If you must know Camby, I know of 3 deer that have been scored twice. Before I was a Boone & Crockett measurer I had to send the "big ones" to someone else for B&C measuring. In 2 of the 3 cases we were within 2/8's of each other. On the third the difference was 1 1/8 or 9/8's. Not bad considering the deer had 23 measurements.

[oldrookie]

outsider looking in, you guys have lost sight of the big picture!(or have forgotten)


oldrookie

[CutNShoot]

outsider looking in, you guys have lost sight of the big picture!(or have forgotten)
oldrookie
Heck it is ALL about big calcium deposits in deer hunting old rookie.

The days are gone when you just went deer hunting to hunt deer.

It is now a quest to get your name in some book and a plaque for your wall.

[BREWERSVILLE OUTFITTERS]

BE # 1 That is it!!!!!!!! show me a good loser and i will show you a LOSER!!!!:cheeky-sm

[Dean Weimer]

Yeah Rook, It's all about big calcium deposits...so let all of those does go so we can have more bucks.


Giant racked whitetail bucks, managing the herd for a balanced buck:doe ratio, keeping population in check, improving habitat (i,e. food plots, natural habitat, burns, mineral supplements), and a great hunting experience go hand in hand with one another.


The "Days of just deer hunting" started for me in 1984, and God willing, I'll do it until the day I die. If you aren't just "deer hunting" anymore then why go anymore?? I shot 3 does and a nice, "trophy" buck this past season. What is not "deer" hunting about that???? And, how many times have you seen my name in any record book???? I DON'T CARE ABOUT MONEY, RECORD BOOKS, SCORES OF BUCKS, AND BEING "FAMOUS"...I JUST LOVE TO GO "DEER HUNTING"!!!!!! If that is a crime then call the police, because I'm guilty!!!!

[treehugger]

Heck it is ALL about big calcium deposits in deer hunting old rookie.

The days are gone when you just went deer hunting to hunt deer.

It is now a quest to get your name in some book and a plaque for your wall.
Until I actually killed a "book buck" I didn't know there were so many different record books or what it took to qualify for any of them. I have never, and I won't start now, gone deer hunting to kill a deer for a record book. If it happens, so be it, but it certainly is not the reason I deer hunt. If that is why you deer hunt, CNS, then perhaps you have lost sight of what it should be and should take some time away from it to find your way back to what it really is all about.

[big dawg01]

New info on the morgantown buck,
I talked with the consevation officers at the Strader show in Louisville today after I dropped off my buck.
They said that the buck WAS taken leagaly!!! and that ther was not nor will there be an investigation.
He also said that the buck has been scored. He had 2 numbers 226" and 216" he did not know if the higher number was a (non typical) score or if was the GROSS measurement.
If this holds true and it was scored TYPICAL it is the next WORLD RECORD whitetail.
I just wanted to let every one know what I heard!

[CutNShoot]

Dean,

Do you actually think that every post I make is directed at you?

However - I don't think you can deny that the "quest for bigger antlers" is a primary goal of a lot of folks on here and in the deer woods - including yourself.

If not why all the "we want to be like them stuff"?

[Hav2HuntEm]

I may be stiring this pot a little more, but I can't resist. I originally posted this question because I was curious. How many times do we get to see a "Typical" buck of that caliber come from Indiana? This has turned into a "who's right", who's wrong" string of posts. I for one can not stand it when everyone says they hunt with no focus or intent on killing or going after "Big" bucks. I believe that these are the guys that just have trouble killing big bucks for one reason or another. I would estimate that a huge percentage of hunters are driven by being able to possibly harvest a trophy class deer. It's what makes most of us scout many days during the off season and spend countless hours, sometimes freezing cold, in our treestands. In my opinion, you either have the bug or you don't. If you don't, I think you get on forrums and hound everyone else for being "Trophy" hunters and say that our sport is being ruined. I believe this is far from the truth. I know that I love "Big Racks" and I also know that I am and will always be a respectful hunter that strives to protect the integrity of this awesome sport and pastime that we all love.

I don't think I'm alone am I????????

Shoot Straight & God Bless

[lilkrou]

Sometimes I think that good 'ole Hickorynut was right when he was slinging around that "i-d-10-T" word around. What would have brought all of us to this sport other than wanting to see critters in the woods and hope that we would be able to harvest one of God's awesome creations????

I for one, find it plenty relaxing shaking in my boots from the utter cold waiting on some critters to start stirring on a cold morning in the woods. If I am able to see the quarry that I am hunting, then that is a truly good day. If I am able to harvest said animal, then that is an awesome day. If I am able to harvest a "monster", I think that I would have a heart attack! Point being, enjoy what we have, not envy what others do or do not have.
I thank God that I am able to live in a country that it is legal to go out and hunt, and that I am able to meander out on my own.
I think that some of you that are posting out here need to refocus. Rather than bicker on here, go watch some paint dry.:bonk:

[Dean Weimer]

Well said lilkrou and have 2 hunt them. I tried the paint thing, but it was too much like a NASCAR race. Sorry Bocephus!!! Get R Dun!!!!!!!


CutNShoot, NO I don't think you aim every one of your posts at me, but you do aim some of them at me...don't you???? That's fine, I don't mind!!!!! You do realize that I'm NOT an antler worshipping Zombie, right???;) I just want you to know that.

[Hav2HuntEm]

Dean W.,

If we pay big $ to mount a buck we have been fortunate enough to kill and hang it in the center of our living room, find ourselves looking at it all the time, reliving the day of the hunt over,and over and over. Are we possibly turning into "Antler Worshipping Zombies"???If so, can you recommend a doctor, I think I might have a problem!!!!!!!

[Dean Weimer]

Come see Dr. Dean, We'll watch Outdoor Channel (i.e. Realtree's Monster Bucks, Drury Outdoors, North American Whitetail T.V., etc.). We'll go out in my hunting woods and look for big rubs, scrapes, shed antlers...and generally try to scout for next season. Maybe we'll even see a giant and start planning next year's strategies. We'll set a course for you. Much of the same as above for the next 231 days. This will get you through until Oct. 1st of 2006. Hopefully your obsessive-compulsiveness, anxiety,hypomanic, irrational behavior will calm down some. I'll do all of this for free too... Why??? Because I need help too brother...let's start a self help group.


Hi I'm Dean, I am addicted to deer hunting. I love giant racked whitetail bucks and deer hunting in general. I love to write about deer hunting too. I have a serious problem...:help:

What will we call ourselves????? A new thread?????


By the way, I saw my first legitimate 180-190 class typical while driving down the road in Iowa one night last Nov. Any idea what that encounter was like???

[JL]

It seems to me that those persons who complain about "antler worshippers" are the ones content to be mediocre hunters that only hunt for meat, and that's fine. What's wrong with the guy that has shot enough basket-racked deer and is now trying to challenge himself and test his patience by hunting a mature whitetail? Do those guys go into the turkey woods content to shoot jakes every year? "These darn beard-worshippers are ruining our sport!" Ridiculous. Just shoot your little deer every year, and don't complain about us shooting our big ones.:evil:

[crookedlake92]

What is wrong with hunting "BIG" bucks. A guy doesn't go buy a $1 lottery ticket and hope to win $2. I generally want to win it all!

[sam fisher]

mr lyon maybe you don't see the sport of hunting a trophy is what one believes
not the size of bone on its head people like you give hunters a bad rep. look at the great hunters of the US .Ted Nuggent hunting should be a sport to not just hang a deer from your livingroom wall but also feeding your family and friends so your wrong in your statement.i have an 8 pointer on my wall that makes the pic of your deer look sick and i'm one of the hunters that believe in eating meat not bones check it out

[JL]

Way to be humble about your deer, Sam....and I'm the one giving hunters a bad name.

[scrapewatcher]

It seems to me that those persons who complain about "antler worshippers" are the ones content to be mediocre hunters that only hunt for meat, and that's fine. What's wrong with the guy that has shot enough basket-racked deer and is now trying to challenge himself and test his patience by hunting a mature whitetail? Do those guys go into the turkey woods content to shoot jakes every year? "These darn beard-worshippers are ruining our sport!" Ridiculous. Just shoot your little deer every year, and don't complain about us shooting our big ones.:evil: i agree. and my left over tags taste good on toast lol.

[CutNShoot]

It seems to me that those persons who complain about "antler worshippers" are the ones content to be mediocre hunters that only hunt for meat, and that's fine. What's wrong with the guy that has shot enough basket-racked deer and is now trying to challenge himself and test his patience by hunting a mature whitetail? Do those guys go into the turkey woods content to shoot jakes every year? "These darn beard-worshippers are ruining our sport!" Ridiculous. Just shoot your little deer every year, and don't complain about us shooting our big ones.:evil:
You've got challenging oneself to hunt only mature whitetails mixed up with "antler worship".

I haven't killed a 1 1/2 year old buck in over 25 years and, yes I do "complain about antler worshippers."

These are the folks that do hunt mature whitetails (as I do) but in addition believe that EVERYONE else should too. IOW - "If you are not hunting MY way, you're hunting wrong."

They place a huge set of antlers and the person that got it, up on a pedestal and basically bow down to them and him/her.

Why do you believe that there are people getting very rich off of hunting big whitetails and even taking shortcuts like Jimmy Houston and a host of others.

We hunters are footing the bills for these folks to do what they do. Why because we worship what they are killing - big antlered bucks.

Why do you think these "pic and shoot" operations even exist at all? As one "pic and shoot" owner told me - They are filling a NEED. Why is that? Because a huge set of antelr is PRIZED by almost all hunters.We have put a price tag on our beloved sport of deer hunting.

We've perverted it..and the "pic and shoot guys" and the "celebrity hunters" thanks us of it..

[JL]

[QUOTE=CutNShoot]You've got challenging oneself to hunt only mature whitetails mixed up with "antler worship".

I haven't killed a 1 1/2 year old buck in over 25 years and, yes I do "complain about antler worshippers."

These are the folks that do hunt mature whitetails (as I do) but in addition believe that EVERYONE else should too. IOW - "If you are not hunting MY way, you're hunting wrong."

CutNShoot:
Don't tell me what I've got mixed up. I don't think, nor did I say that anyone was wrong for NOT hunting mature whitetails...you quoted my post in your reply; go back and read it this time.

[Dean Weimer]

We hunters are footing the bills for these folks to do what they do. Why because we worship what they are killing - big antlered bucks.

Why do you think these "pic and shoot" operations even exist at all? As one "pic and shoot" owner told me - They are filling a NEED. Why is that? Because a huge set of antelr is PRIZED by almost all hunters.We have put a price tag on our beloved sport of deer hunting.

We've perverted it..and the "pic and shoot guys" and the "celebrity hunters" thanks us of it..

Remember Cut N Shoot, Not everyone would hunt in the Bellar-Type places, and the " celebrity hunters" generally hunt in fair chase situations. Remember, while Jimmy may have been a celebrity, he can't be considered a "hunter". When you say "pic and shoot guys"...who are you referring to??? Just curious!!

[sam fisher]

mr lyon i'm not a big buck worshipper i hunt for food and pleasure just happens that when you hunt right you may get that one or two deer that come by and it would be your dream deer my dream deer is meat in the freezer not boiling bones for broth.you know its all about what you put into it i guess i just hate to hear people talk about the only reason they are in the deer woods is they have to kill the big one"trophy" thats not what hunting is enjoyment with friends and family

[big dawg01]

It seems to me that harvesting a mature whitetail buck is ENJOYMENT!!!

Why go into the woods planning on shooting the first thing that moves? If "killers" A.K.A "hunters" think that is enjoyment The Sport is really going down the tubes!
I spend a lot of effort planing stand placements & scouting, I do not feel it is "LUCK" to see a deer! It could be that some people are hunting the wrong places!
I do not shoot a whitetail unless I think it is at least 3 yrs. old wheather it is a doe or a buck. I have taken bucks that do not make the books but EVERY one of them dressed out at least 200 lbs. and 135 on the doe's
Do yourself a favor and wait for that mature animal. I LOVE to eat venison as well, but I'm not going to kill a button buck because I have a hunger craving!!
If venison is what supports your family I guess you are in the "right" and I support that!

[JL]

I couldn't agree more, Dawg. Sam, I don't consider myself a big buck worshipper, but I've shot enough little bucks. I would rather go out and shoot a decent mature whitetail than a little buck now...I passed on MANY smaller bucks before I harvested the buck in my avatar photo, which isn't going to make any book, but with the hunting pressure around my area is a damn fine animal. By the way, I didn't eat the antlers on that deer, but I will eat the 102 lbs. of boneless meat I got out of that deer...(196 # dressed):corkysm55 Trust me, I'm out there for the right reasons.

[brad24]

It seems to me that harvesting a mature whitetail buck is ENJOYMENT!!!

Why go into the woods planning on shooting the first thing that moves? If "killers" A.K.A "hunters" think that is enjoyment The Sport is really going down the tubes!
I spend a lot of effort planing stand placements & scouting, I do not feel it is "LUCK" to see a deer! It could be that some people are hunting the wrong places!
I do not shoot a whitetail unless I think it is at least 3 yrs. old wheather it is a doe or a buck. I have taken bucks that do not make the books but EVERY one of them dressed out at least 200 lbs. and 135 on the doe's
Do yourself a favor and wait for that mature animal. I LOVE to eat venison as well, but I'm not going to kill a button buck because I have a hunger craving!!
If venison is what supports your family I guess you are in the "right" and I support that!
I have read a lot of these posts and i got to jump in. Who are you to say what should be anothers person enjoyment or expectations of hunting? Not everyone goes deer hunting to kill record book deer, if somebody elects to kill the first thing that moves, thats their choice, and if it ever gets to the point to where we start criticising people becuase of the size of someones deer, then you are right, the sport will really go down the tubes. I have to comment on the post about mediocre hunters as well. I know many "mediocre" hunters that have killed nice bucks. The kind that go scout the week before the season and then kill the deer at 9am opening morning. It's a thing called luck. Several "good" hunters are probably wishing they had a little of it this past season.

[sam fisher]

well said and i don't by beef we do eat deer only

[JL]

I don't disagree that there is a bit of luck that goes into harvesting large deer. However, I think most of those hunters won't consistently harvest larger deer (maybe I'm wrong). I have no problem with anyone who strictly meat hunts. I have said that is fine if that's the way that they want to hunt. What I am saying is that it is equally as remiss to criticize the hunters that hold out for larger animals.

[seabee]

Sam,
Whats up man, I dont know what it is with you and emails.
Hey if you are in town this week give me a call one night. We can talk about which piece of public land we can take one of these monster bucks of off at deer camp next year! From one mediocre hunter to another.;)
Curtis

[Dean Weimer]

I am a meat hunter and a mature buck hunter. I killed three does, helped manage the herd in my county and put plenty of meat in the freezer. I also killed a decent buck too. Yes, I held out for a better one. My question to the other meat hunters is Do you guys shoot does too??? They are pretty tasty critters...I must say!!!! I do know some guys that still don't like the idea of killing some surplus does!!!!!

[sam fisher]

you betchya

[Dean Weimer]

They are doe-liscious!!!!!!

[jbwhttail]

Suddenly we have a mature buck hunter who decries antler worship!! He constantly is working every angle to get the old system of two bucks back, yet he does not worship antlers? Must be another part of the male whitetail anatomy??

Yes CutNShoot I saw your wording of "Mature whitetails" and that could be either sex. But really how many mature does did you take this year?Could you graph it in percentage of the available antlerless harvest available to you as an individual?

Opportunity= big mature whitetail buck to CutNShoot.

[jbwhttail]

Camby:

Would you like to be a man and apologize about your claim that the father had already tagged a buck?

You posted it and got called on it, now are you going to apologize to the family and hunters in general?

[big dawg01]

I have read a lot of these posts and i got to jump in. Who are you to say what should be anothers person enjoyment or expectations of hunting? Not everyone goes deer hunting to kill record book deer, if somebody elects to kill the first thing that moves, thats their choice, and if it ever gets to the point to where we start criticising people becuase of the size of someones deer, then you are right, the sport will really go down the tubes. I have to comment on the post about mediocre hunters as well. I know many "mediocre" hunters that have killed nice bucks. The kind that go scout the week before the season and then kill the deer at 9am opening morning. It's a thing called luck. Several "good" hunters are probably wishing they had a little of it this past season.Brad,
I do not think I was criticising anyone. I was just trying to get the point acrossed that hunters should do their best to kill a mature animal weather it be a 250lb. 4 point or a 180lb. doe. I beleive it is better for the health and genitics of the deer herd.
I personaly do not kill anything I do not intend to eat! If you want to bash someone bash the "killer's" out there that do not even eat the venison that they kill!!!! I have see several people like this and it makes me SICK!
Now if you chose or rely on venison for your family to survive, do what must be done. If you do not have enough I would be glad to help you out with the 300+ pounds I have in the freezer from the 3 mature whitetails I was "lucky" enough to harvest this passed season.