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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Lets see, a mature whitetail buck is at his most vulnerable state during this time of the year. Usually November 1st thru the 21st. It would only make sense that anyone serious about improving the quality and quanity of mature whitetail buck in our state to vote for a closed season during this time on bucks.

Lets look at fishing. Many states have seasons on species of fish, most of which are after the spawning period. Why you might ask? To take the pressure of the big females that are at a vulnerable stage of their lives. Also to make sure that the next generation of fish is at least able to be hatched, from then its in Gods hands. Lake St. Clair is a perfect example. They have a closed season on large and smallmouth bass during the spawing period. This enables the lake to sustain one of the highest population of smallies in the world as well as quality fish.

Seems a lot of guys are only in favor of the OBR rule for buck management here in Indiana, which will help, but not to the extent that a closed season would during the rut. As I have stated before the OBR rule only effected bow hunters that also gun hunted. It hasn't changed a thing for the gun only hunters, they were not taking two buck prior, well at least not legally.

I'd like to hear your guys responses to this idea
 

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Let's have one full deer season where no bucks at all are allowed to be taken. Then the following year and years after have the deer season held out of the peak rut period.
 

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How do????

It's not necessary to close the hunting during the rut. Archers still don't kill many bucks, even during the rut. (See: Iowa). I AM a firearms hunter too, so everyone who reads this and is a gun hunter only, know that I am a shotgun and muzzleloader hunter too.
 

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Man you guys beat these topics to death, But i guess thats what this forum is for. Here is my take on all thats been going on. Moving deer season out of the rut because thats when bucks are vulnerable is kind of silly. I see your point...(well kinda). You stated that it would (improve the quality and quantity of big bucks) which you are correct it just might, But my point is whats the difference in chasing one big buck during the rut or three big bucks come December. Sounds like the December hunt actually has better odds. So once again are we really thinking about US, by having more big bucks later in the season, which is human behavior, or about the poor whitetail that doesnt know how to control himself come the first part of november. Now since i am on my soapbox, I will comment on a few other topics that have been around. (Shortening of the firearms season). I dont think it will affect the big buck population as much as people think. A HUGE percentage of the big bucks are killed on the first weekend. I want as much time as i need to enjoy my hunts, i dont want to go into season thinking i have three days to kill a buck, That may just have a negative affect and i might shoot the first little basket rack that walks by fearing i will not have another chance till next november. After all we are trying to improve the antler size. Last but not least Crossbows, We are spending way to much time crying about the use of crossbows. If anyone says we shouldnt use crossbows than you better not be walking in the woods with a shotgun or one of those inline smokepoles that are good out to 200 yards. Because the whole idea about crossbows is that it is to easy and to much like a riffle. With 95 percent of indianas land being privately owned, if someone is not hunting on the same land as you now during archery season, then it is highly unlikely that they will be there with a crossbow come opening morning of archery season. What does it really matter how that one buck per year is taken as long as it is taken legally. Lets just keep hunting simple and enjoyable, there are to many greedy hunters out there that think they need hundreds of acres to themselves so they can harvest a huge whitetail and show it off to all their friends. If you have a great spot, take someone hunting, you may just find it more enjoyable to watch a very gratefull friend harvest a mature whitetail, more so than harvesting it yourself! Stay humble and you will be awarded in the woods. Finally, the OBR has been a turn for the better in our deer herd and I, as much as the next guy wants to have an oportunity to harvest a giant buck. If we fill our woods with a bunch of 150 to 160 class bucks then we are eventualy going to get bored of shooting them year after year. As human nature we want more and more, so we need to start focusing on whats really important and thats spending as much QUALITY time in the woods, not seeing who can get in and get out with the biggest buck the quickest. So to sum up all that i wrote i will say this, The OBR is working, get out there in the fall and take what ever buck you feel like , by whatever weapon you feel like (as long as it is legal) and dont worry about what anyone thinks about you, You are the one thats being rewarded for all the hard work and effort. God Bless and Shoot straight!
SEABEE
 

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Rut Nov. 1 to the 21? if a doe dont get bred the first time around is'nt there up to 3 cycles? which could go into January? When would we hunt ,maybe feb. to Sept. i guess? The big ones are still hard to get during the rut,if not there wouldn't be any by now,i got mine on the 24th nov.,only by luck/determation.He was about 9 years old,and all these years he made it through the rut with hunters all around.Nuff said,i like the season just where it is.
 

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Yea Dean ,of course,but i do like the seasons where their at,I saw very late rut activity this year,it was strange compared to other years,but i saw no rubs/scapes till 22nd nov,in about 500 acres good habitat,All other years i saw those signs before gun season,just when would a differant season be? would it REALY matter much? Things vary year to year.
Dean Weimer said:
Reloader, Would you like to see even more big bucks around your hunting area than there are now?????
 

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Yea Dean ,of course,but i do like the seasons where their at,I saw very late rut activity this year,it was strange compared to other years,but i saw no rubs/scapes till 22nd nov,in about 500 acres good habitat,All other years i saw those signs before gun season,just when would a differant season be? would it REALY matter much? Things vary year to year.


Reloader, while whitetails in the Midwest breed at the same times every year, it isn't always so visible. I'm not sure where you're from, but was it warm in your part of the state during Nov.?? The buck:doe ratio always plays into the "visibility" of the rut too.

To answer the last three questions...the only way that I know that a non-rut, firearms season would produce tons and tons of more BIG bucks is because the states surrounding us (esp. Ohio, Illinois, Iowa, etc.) are grossly outproducing us in terms of TRUE giants, and have been for years. If Indiana would go to a format similar to say Iowa, this state would start cranking out a bunch of GIANTS. My only motivation for this is that you, I and everyone else in Indiana would have more of a chance to shoot real giants every season. Sure, there are monsters out there, and there have always been SOME, but not a bunch of them. The last three years have shown a huge increase in the numbers of HRBP, Boone and Crockett, and Pope and YOung record bucks being harvested in our state. Indiana has as much, if not MORE, potential for real giants as anywhere in the continent.If you don't believe me call Gordon Whittington (he told me this would be O.K.) and talk to him. He is recognized by all to be one of/ if not THE top Whitetail expert in the world.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I am glad to see someone (Dean) stand up and speak the truth. When it comes down to the truth it seems a majority of hunters are not willing to give up anything to better the buck population. I would think more of you would see the validity that this suggestion/ idea holds.

For this reason I would like to see the OBR be done away with. I mean I bow and gun hunt, I have a lifetime license, and this would mean one more deer in the freezer for my family. Also it is a great tool to be used by the wise hunters as a way to cull out inferior bucks. I would venture to say that very few, probably less then 500 guys actually took a HRB buck with a bow and gun in the same year when the old rule applied. I mean how would I hurt the buck population by taking a four pointer in bow and a 5 or 6 pointer in gun??????? It wouldn't, neither of these two bucks would amount to anything and they are just a bad genetic inseminating machine, passing along inferior genes with any doe that will stay still for 20 seconds, kinda sounds like an old roommate of mine LOL
 

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Dean Weimer said:
It's not necessary to close the hunting during the rut. Archers still don't kill many bucks, even during the rut. (See: Iowa). I AM a firearms hunter too, so everyone who reads this and is a gun hunter only, know that I am a shotgun and muzzleloader hunter too.
""Archers still don't kill many bucks, even during the rut.""

lol lolo lol lol lol lol lol

Your toooooo funny!

Wasn't it ALL those archers that were killing so many dinks in the early season AND then another during the gun season....WAKE UP MAN!!!!!.......That "archer" in the early season is the SAME FELLA during gun season!!!!

DEAN,

If you TRUELY beleive what you just said.....(Archers still don't kill many bucks, even during the rut.).....Then WHY do you put so much support behind the OBR?
 

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Very funny indeed!!!!!

Camby, I've been awake all along.It's our state's DFW that has been asleep all these years. I ask another simple question.

What's worse.... 96,000 hunters hunting during the rut with weapons that are accurate out to about 40 yards, or

159,100 hunting with weapons that today are accurate out to almost 200 yards??
**espnoutdoors.com**

In 2004 archers killed 22,ooo deer, and the firearms harvest was 72,900. (Bucks and does...)
And you want me to wake up.

You do remember what Illinois' top bucks looked like compared to ours don't you?? I'll put them back on here if you want me to. Remember, Illinois, the state right next door that only gun hunts for 7 days at the end of the primary rut?????

I hate to tell you guys but the OBR is here to stay!!! And eventually, we'll hopefully get that firearms season out of the rut for good. That's next up on the agenda for a MAJORITY of Indiana's deer hunters. The sooner the better!!!!!
 

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I mean how would I hurt the buck population by taking a four pointer in bow and a 5 or 6 pointer in gun??????? It wouldn't, neither of these two bucks would amount to anything and they are just a bad genetic inseminating machine, passing along inferior genes with any doe that will stay still for 20 seconds, kinda sounds like an old roommate of mine LOL[/QUOTE]

O.K. so I see where you are coming from. That little 4,5, and 6 pointer would grow up to be a monster IF you don't shoot him when he is 1.5. Inferior genetics???NO...he just needs time to mature. And this is precisely what the OBR is allowing them to do. Do you think that 1.5 year-old 4,5, or 6 pointer's Daddy was a big bruiser????? If he was ALLOWED to grow old, I'll guarantee you he was a giant.
The OBR is doing exactly what it was intended to do....give some bucks a chance to grow and maturre into their genetic potential. Do you think the good lord intended for bucks not to grow old and produce big racks??? Why do they get bigger every year then?????
 

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i love the obr. why? i wanna BIGGIN. i am just tired of killin dinks but i love to watch em. did i get a bigin this yr? no. i had the oppertunities with a bow but didn't connect. i took some ribbing from my dink killing hunting buddies but i really don't care anymore. they can kill what they want. my goal is a p&y with a bow or nothing. i'll just take a doe. all i want is one a yr. "getting closer" i don't feel i need 2 or 3. a yr. i had several oppertunities for basket rack 6 or 8's this yr. and guess what they'll be nice 2 or 3 yr. olds this yr. i can't wait. it's pay back time this yr. lol. just to know i put myself in front of 2 nice p&y bucks in the 135 to 140 class this yr. makes me feel all warm an tingly inside lol. i'm gonna hunt harder this yr. and as far as tags going up so what it's still a cheap sorce of entertainment. i see people spending more on worthless scratch off tickets every week than what deer tags cost. my only beef with the tag system is buying a different tag for every weopon. why not one price for a one size fits all till you tag out. i wanna tag out this yr. just as much as anybody but not on a dink. LET EM WALK.
 

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I know how you feel scrapewatcher, I'm with you on the OBR. All my deer hunting friends has wall hangers and yes I get ribbed over it. I have seen some huge bucks (I think 125 to 140 class) and never got close enough for a shot and did not want to take a shot that I thought was to far away. Opening day I did get a good 8 pointer which I thought would work on the wall. It way not a 130 or 150 class buck, but it was a great buck to me. Hope they keep the OBR around for a long time.
 

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I guess we could be more like Ohio and run our early bow season through the rut, and not bring gun season in until almost November. Wouldn't that solve the whole thing about not having too many hunters out there during the rut.
 

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well i don't think any thing is wrong with our season. that's why i think the obr is a great thing. let's face it not every one will want to wait on a true trophy. there's a lot of people out there who have no where to hunt except public land. and that's a good thing it's part of our freedom. their not going to hold off simply because of the fact that if they don't shoot that little 4 pointer the guy down the ridge will. a lot hunters quit after the 1st day or too any way their tired of freezing to death. that's why so many of them are back at their truck drinking coffee at 8 o'clock. they don't know how to prepare for the cold. but if we start limiting hunters who gets denied 1st. the only other option would be a draw and how many of us want that. i think most hunters who hunt trophy's won't shoot a dink regardless if he can kill 5 bucks. if he wants meat he'll take a doe. they do what they can to protect their resource. i think that the obr can't do anything but help the state of indiana. but i'm not against a guy cause he wants a dink. his choice. now if i had a bunch of land i would yea i would set some restrictions on buck size for those i let hunt but i don't have any land lol. i look for in the next 5 yrs. for in. to be a hot place for trophy's. i'll be tickeled to death with a pope&young.
 

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I Would Approve Of Moving The Firearms Season Out Of The Peak Rut Providing Archery Stays In During That Time And That I Would Have The Ability To Harvest A Second Buck Per Season, Should I Wish To.

If I Could Bow Hunt Until Late November Before Picking Up My Gun, I Could Live With That.
 

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scrapewatcher said:
i love the obr. why? i wanna BIGGIN. i am just tired of killin dinks but i love to watch em. did i get a bigin this yr? no. i had the oppertunities with a bow but didn't connect. i took some ribbing from my dink killing hunting buddies but i really don't care anymore. they can kill what they want. my goal is a p&y with a bow or nothing. i'll just take a doe. all i want is one a yr. "getting closer" i don't feel i need 2 or 3. a yr. i had several oppertunities for basket rack 6 or 8's this yr. and guess what they'll be nice 2 or 3 yr. olds this yr. i can't wait. it's pay back time this yr. lol. just to know i put myself in front of 2 nice p&y bucks in the 135 to 140 class this yr. makes me feel all warm an tingly inside lol. i'm gonna hunt harder this yr. and as far as tags going up so what it's still a cheap sorce of entertainment. i see people spending more on worthless scratch off tickets every week than what deer tags cost. my only beef with the tag system is buying a different tag for every weopon. why not one price for a one size fits all till you tag out. i wanna tag out this yr. just as much as anybody but not on a dink. LET EM WALK.
Good Response!!! We need more people like you in the woods:bonk:
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Dean, proven fact a buck with bad genetics will never be a HRB buck, NEVER. My good friend and neighbor is a taxidermist, I have seen many 4-7 year old bucks that do not make the HRB. That is just the way it is.
Not to argue, but I would love to see any data that backs your claim. Not all bucks are going to be HRB bucks, guarenteed. Look at the big deer ranches in Texas, those little bucks are taken out before they have a chance to breed.

Just like humans, not all of us grow up to be a superior physical human, the same goes in the animal world
 

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bowaddict said:
I am glad to see someone (Dean) stand up and speak the truth. When it comes down to the truth it seems a majority of hunters are not willing to give up anything to better the buck population. I would think more of you would see the validity that this suggestion/ idea holds.

For this reason I would like to see the OBR be done away with. I mean I bow and gun hunt, I have a lifetime license, and this would mean one more deer in the freezer for my family. Also it is a great tool to be used by the wise hunters as a way to cull out inferior bucks. I would venture to say that very few, probably less then 500 guys actually took a HRB buck with a bow and gun in the same year when the old rule applied. I mean how would I hurt the buck population by taking a four pointer in bow and a 5 or 6 pointer in gun??????? It wouldn't, neither of these two bucks would amount to anything and they are just a bad genetic inseminating machine, passing along inferior genes with any doe that will stay still for 20 seconds, kinda sounds like an old roommate of mine LOL
Why not harvest a doe to feed your family with?????????

This would hurt the buck population. If you could actually age the deer on the hoof accurately (which you cannot!!) and know it is at least 4 or 5 yrs old and it is still a 4 0r 5 pointer then I would say go ahead and harvest as this would be a inferior deer. Since you cannot age the buck on the spot why not shoot a doe to fill your freezer. :bash:
 
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