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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Wow, I can't respond to any of the threads I want to because they're all getting closed so fast. How many of you agree that the IDNR...or, I should say, the Deer Management Program... has tried to mislead the citizens of Indiana to try and do away with the one buck rule???? Let this one ride for a bit Steve...this is legitimate.
 

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The OBR is here to stay.

There is/was/will always be disagreement within the IDNR.

I wouldn't want the IDNR or any other gummint group to have 100% agreement by all employess 100% of the time on everything. Would you?

If they a cant talk opposing views and hash it and MAYBE come to a reasonable compromise then we will have a dicatarship of one.That is very bad.

Kyle is very smart man and he listens to every side of the debate and then makes up his own mind. I applaud him for that.

What I find as terribly funny is that amateur biologists that maybe went through a QDM course think they can run the deer management in Indiana better than trained professionals.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
From armchair to amatuer!!! I'm gaining!!!

Allright, you finally got back with one of my responses. Thank you!!! What I find even funnier is that we have PHD toting Biologists who don't have a clue whatsoever. ;) Before I was an armchair biologist, now I'm an "Amatuer Biologist that went through a QDM course". Hmmm, my stock is rising!!!!!!! Put this "amatuer" in charge of the Indiana Deer Management Program and things will get done...finally!!!!!
 

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Dean Weimer said:
Allright, you finally got back with one of my responses. Thank you!!! What I find even funnier is that we have PHD toting Biologists who don't have a clue whatsoever. ;) Before I was an armchair biologist, now I'm an "Amatuer Biologist that went through a QDM course". Hmmm, my stock is rising!!!!!!! Put this "amatuer" in charge of the Indiana Deer Management Program and things will get done...finally!!!!!
That is YOUR opinion.



I've been a deer hunter probably longer than you are old so I know where we came from and where we are today and MOST of that great progress was under the tutelage of that "PHD toting Biologist".



BTW - I never called you an "armchair biologist".
 

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Doom and Gloom!!!!!

I am 34 years old, and have been hunting deer since I was 12. In that 20 plus years of hunting I have only recently (albeit they did it hesitantly) seen Indiana climb out of the stone age into the 21st century. This isn't your, or your grandpa's deer management any longer. Why can't you just hunt and forget about all the doom and gloom???? Can you give me any credit for getting articles published in major deer hunting publications, or are you so set against me that you won't acknowledge that??? I don't have a PHD, but I know a thing or two about deer management. You can thank the mass media for "educating" me on today's whitetail deer management. I have no interest in what happened in the first 50 or so years of deer management in our state. It's no secret in hunting circles that Indiana's Deer Management has been a joke compared to most states surrounding us. I am not the only one with this opinion either. You know the people who I am associated with...

Under the tutelage of that Phd toting biologist that was "forced" into by "amatuer, arm chair, biologists" that had a much better way...based on modern management in surrounding states. Why won't Dr. Mitchell shorten up the firearms season and hold it after the primary rut?????
 

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Dean,

How much influence do you suppose the insurance companys of the state have on setting the deer bag limits and season dates??? It has been my findings that this state is not ran by the DNR it is ran by the Insurance Companies. People in Illinois pay huge Motor Vehicle Insurance costs. I do know some things about QDM but I am not a pro on the subject. Just wanted your opinion..
 

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Dean Weimer said:
I am 34 years old, and have been hunting deer since I was 12.
Like I said - I've been a deer hunter longer than you are old.

Under the tutelage of that Phd toting biologist that was "forced" into by "amatuer, arm chair, biologists" that had a much better way...based on modern management in surrounding states. Why won't Dr. Mitchell shorten up the firearms season and hold it after the primary rut?????
You mean there was absolutely no progress in our deer herd ever under Jim Mitchel until he was "forced' to go to the OBR?

C'mon...now that is totally funny..
 

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Questions for an expert...

When is the primary rut in Indiana?

What natural occurances dictate the timing of the rut?

Why do does have twins so often?

What causes CWD?

What is the best way to get the true age of a deer?

Why does Indiana pale in comparison )to the production of giant Boone and Crockett class bucks) to most of our neighbors?

When is the best time to harvest a giant buck?

What is progress in your opinion??

You've been at this so much longer than I have you should know the answer to all of these questions...;)
 

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Does the IDNR make the rule changes on bag limits, and if so are there forums held statewide by the IDNR for the hunting public to attend?
 

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Dean Weimer said:
Wow, I can't respond to any of the threads I want to because they're all getting closed so fast. How many of you agree that the IDNR...or, I should say, the Deer Management Program... has tried to mislead the citizens of Indiana to try and do away with the one buck rule???? Let this one ride for a bit Steve...this is legitimate.
Steve hasn't closed them - the supermoderators closed the threads. These conversations have been quickly degenerating and won't stay open if they do. Personal animosities are not part of the vision of the Indiana Sportsman
 

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POP A TOP AGAIN :help:
 

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Hoyt_Rocks said:
Dean,

How much influence do you suppose the insurance companys of the state have on setting the deer bag limits and season dates??? It has been my findings that this state is not ran by the DNR it is ran by the Insurance Companies. People in Illinois pay huge Motor Vehicle Insurance costs. I do know some things about QDM b
ut I am not a pro on the subject. Just wanted your opinion..
HEY HOYT, I HAVE WORKED FOR THE STATES LARGEST INSURANCE COMPANY FOR 19 YEARS. I HAVE INQUIRED ABOUT YOUR SUSPICIONS, I CAN SAY THAT MY COMPANY, STATE FARM, DOES NOT LOBBY THE IDNR AT ALL TO INCREASE DEER KILLS.

IT IS MY UNDERSTANDING THAT IT IS THE INDIANA FARM BUREAU THAT DOES MOST OF THE IDNR ARM TWISTING.
 

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Hey the way I look at if we always to, what we always did, we will always get what we always got. Some times it hard to change but if we want our grand grandkids to enjoy some of the hunting and see deer we are going to have to change. Think about with houses going up all over good hunting ground there is going to be less woods and feed grounds for the deer. I think instead of barking at each other we need to all join togather and see what we can do for the years ahead. Yes there is places where you can kill that record book deer and like around where I am at we must do something to get the bucks up to the record size. I do not know the answer but if we all work at it togather maybe with all of our ideas we can naje a different.
Question: who is going to the Indy show and what day? I will be going Saturday. Why don't we put somekind of name tags on so we will know each other. I would love to meet some of you if not all of you and talk hunting and fishing.
 

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Dean Weimer said:
When is the primary rut in Indiana?

What natural occurances dictate the timing of the rut?

Why do does have twins so often?

What causes CWD?

What is the best way to get the true age of a deer?

Why does Indiana pale in comparison )to the production of giant Boone and Crockett class bucks) to most of our neighbors?

When is the best time to harvest a giant buck?

What is progress in your opinion??

You've been at this so much longer than I have you should know the answer to all of these questions...;)
Answers from an amatuer:
1) The Primary Rut in Indiana runs approx. the 7th of Nov. through around Thanksgiving, with peaks in the teens (i.e. 10-15).

2) While natural happenstances like moonlight/phase, temperature, etc. have been known to "enhance" the "intensity" of the primary breeding phase, it occurs at the same times every year. Some years the "rut" is more visible than others, however, Northern and Midwestern deer in particular are November breeders. They have evolved that way over the millenia because this allows fawns to be dropped at precisely the right time for optimum survival rates around 195-200 days after insemination.

3) Normally does have two fawns although they aren't always true twins. As a doe is bred, she has usually dropped two eggs (one down each tube) and they are then fertilized by two different sperm. Although generally these are offspring of the same buck, they aren't true twins, as we humans know them. Sometimes a doe can actually get both eggs fertilized by two DIFFERENT bucks.

The reason whitetails have so many offspring is because the reproductive system of the doe is geared to totally resaturate its range in as little as 7 years. This is why it is so important to harvest surplus does. They are literally baby making machines.

4) Chronic Wasting Disease is caused by prions. Prions are microscopic protein particles similar to a virus, but lacking nucleic acid, thought to be the infectious agent that causes of CWD, scrapie, and certain other degenerative diseases of the nervous system.

Prions get in the brain of infected animals and eat holes in the brain. The brains of infected deer have been said to look like "swiss cheese".

5) The best time to harvest a giant racked buck is...anytime that you are in your tree stand. While the Rut is responsible for the demise of many giant buck *although peak rut can actually cause a dissappearance of local bucks as they "hole up" with does in off-the-wall places), so to is the first few evenings of bow season when bucks, which presumably haven't been spooked, can be found on their late summer/ early fall bedding to eating pattern. Another great time to catch a giant off guard is in the late season. When cold temperatures and snow force deer to eat, big bucks can be more vulnerable than at any time of the season...sans the Rut.

While these 3 time frames might statistically show the best time to harvest a true giant, such deer are harvested at different times throughout the deer season by patient hunters who have done their homework.

5) How do you define progress??????
 

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Dean,

If you have been deer hunting for 20+ years and can't recognize progress there is no use in me trying to explain it to you..
 
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